Mr Ag Nostic
Hi Mr Ag Nostic,
I think you are more reasonable then the theist or deist here. But there is some things which I would like to point out.
First of all about the budhist comment. If you share with them your concern then they might just stop doing it or go else where. Otherwise, they aren't budhist. It's probably some new age stuff.
Now imagine, a preacher coming to your home, and telling you that your God is all bull, and that only their god is true.
Families with different believes are broken. A m uslim, can't eat with non-believers and a christian can't perform (if they don't snort) when non- believers are performing rites.
And why is this the case? because the contents of some religions are destructive in nature. It does not allow people to be non-believers.
So where does tolerance come into play?
Probably tolerance will only come when the whole world believes in only 1 religion or there are no religion at all.
"God created everything.
If God created existence.
then How could God have existed before that?"
Explaining things like infinity is just like explaining the above.
It's not that difficult really. It is both amazing, but why try so hard to understand?
At least we know infinity is real. Live with it.
I think the best way to get to people is to see things from their perspective. If we don't then we're just hitting a wall.
Anyway, as mentioned through out the forum. It's not about proving God doesn't exist. It's about proving he exist. There is no need to prove that god not exist. Because there is no reason to believe in him in the first place. To disprove him, will be like asking us to disprove Santa Clause, the Tooth Fairy, The Boogey Man and Elves. Do we have to disprove them? You can try, but a believer will simply say it's magic.
Evidence is proof. And the bible is not proof. We cannot use an assumption as proof. But theist keep insisting that it is proof. If we can settle the idea that it is just an assumption and not proof. Then at least we can agree that there is no proof in God what so ever.
After we have settle that. Then lets move on to understand about faith. We should only have faith if a.) We are helpless or b.) There are supporting proof that our assumption is true. (take pete's chair example)
However as of now, there is no proof or supporting proof what soever.
And most of all. The bible refers to itself as the complete truth. If any 1 of it fails. Then the whole thing must be a fake.
if it is only a mere guide (like some christians say) then my advice is to follow your own moral compass, and don't believe too much on the god part it has done more harm than good.
You have one group concerned with faith and belief, that by very definition do not require proof. While on the other you have a group solely concerned with evidence trying to address a topic that is unprovable and at the very least beyond our capability / technology - who do not believe God exists.
"If you do not hate your father, mother... etc you can not be my deciple"
Can you still reason with someone who has commited themselves as that?
On the other hand, is it so wrong if you teach someone critical thinking, so they can differentiate fact, and fiction for themselves?
We're not asking our kids to read the mantra "there is no God"
So that's what we are trying to do. Outlining all facts. Proof/disprove assumptions to establish more facts, once everything has been said.
Correct me if I am wrong but there were certain issues which have been pointed out to disprove the christian belief but have not yet been countered. Thus, by laws of logic and common sense that is at present the fact.
Somethings are not as clear as religion.
Those who care, already knows. Those Who don't know never would want to know. Therefore to think has no benefit but to self??
Last edited by TÐöer; 11th May 2009 at 12:17 PM. Reason: typo