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  #11  
Old 14th February 2017, 12:04 AM
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Default Re: Soul of an atheist

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surreptitious57 said View Post
What is death anyway but merely the transference from a state of consciousness to one of non consciousness
There is zero evidence of anything else. No one ever had a problem with non existence before they were born
So they should not have one with it after they die. The dead never worry about being dead. Only the living do
"I do not fear death. I had been dead for millions and millions of years before I was born, and had not suffered the slightest inconvenience from it"
Mark Twain
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  #12  
Old 14th February 2017, 04:46 AM
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Default Re: Soul of an atheist

http://candide.nypl.org/text/chapter-1

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Observe, that the nose has been formed to bear spectacles—thus we have spectacles. Legs are visibly designed for stockings—and we have stockings.
Voltaire's satire on teleological arguments.

Basically Xerxes, you've got your reasoning upside down. As DB points out above, there's a vast chasm between function and purpose.

Purpose presupposes a reason, a plan, an intention. As such, it also necessitates a planner, an intender, Pascal's watchmaker.

I find it hard to imagine how you could reject the notion of an entity that would be a requirement for consistency with respect to your view of purpose.


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Xerxes said
It would seem pointless for me to learn as much as I will in this body, only to cease to be when my body dies....and as nothing in the universe seems to be pointless, it isn't logical that I would cease to be.
See, now this is the kind of hole you can dig yourself into with Purposes!

Nothing in this universe has a purpose other than the things animals (particularly humans) make. Of course, we can find a purpose for nearly everything, but that then would be a human plan.

Regardless, to go from there being migrations and dung-beetles (both evolved behaviors) to a contorted position that denies the finality of consciousness is obviously quite problematic as even if there were universal purpose, it wouldn't mean that purposes couldn't come to an end.

Put it this way - where was your consciousness before you were born? Was it only half way in you when you were a child? Did this consciousness external to your brain just so happen to grow as you matured and became more aware? What happens to this consciousness while you're asleep? Does it pop off down the bar with its mates?

Can you not conceive of a better explanation for your consciousness than there being an eternal purpose for it? I'm pretty sure a vastly more parsimonious explanation arises from animals evolving new traits over generations and retaining the ones that help them survive and reproduce.
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  #13  
Old 14th February 2017, 10:17 AM
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Default Re: Soul of an atheist

I can't imagine a life without porpoises!
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  #14  
Old 14th February 2017, 11:38 AM
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Default Re: Soul of an atheist

There is no evidence that a person's memories and/or personality exist after the brain is dead.

There is, however, evidence that the prospect of eternal existence is the primary carrot Religion dangles in front of people to keep them filling the contribution box.
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  #15  
Old 14th February 2017, 12:32 PM
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Default Re: Soul of an atheist

On a slightly tangential note regarding purpose, the fear or concern of ceasing to exist does have an obvious evolutionary purpose. When you are tempted to view yourself as immortal, it is probably a good idea to take that into account.

And yes, you can be an atheist while still believing that you have an immortal soul. You can also be a theist and not believe that you have an immortal soul.
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  #16  
Old 14th February 2017, 03:40 PM
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Default Re: Soul of an atheist

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Xermes said View Post
I answered 'yes' to the profile question, 'Do you believe in an everlasting soul'. At first glance that probably seems a strange thing coming from an atheist. A couple of you asked me to expand. I'm glad you asked.

Here's my theory......

When I say 'soul', I am referring to my consciousness.

Not to be be confused with an incorporeal essence of indeterminate purpose... like some shiny blob at the mercy of a non-existent deity.

My definition of my 'soul' is my consciousness, me, currently being hosted by this body.

It seems to me that everything in this amazingly intricate and meticulous Universe has a purpose. Anything you can think of....animal migration, magnetic attraction, eyelashes, dung beetles. So I have to conclude that I have a purpose and as far as I can judge, my purpose is to learn. It's the one thing that every living thing has in common..we learn (and to breed more hosts for other 'souls'. (Remember the definition). What can I be learning about but the Universe? I believe that the Universe must be scientifically quantifiable, but while I'm in this body, my understanding is restricted to my experience within this host.

It would seem pointless for me to learn as much as I will in this body, only to cease to be when my body dies....and as nothing in the universe seems to be pointless, it isn't logical that I would cease to be.

Just putting it out there.


Really? You think you're that important, that your consciousness is that vital to anything that it must go on after the death of your physical body? Why?



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  #17  
Old 14th February 2017, 05:24 PM
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Default Re: Soul of an atheist

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142857 said View Post
On a slightly tangential note regarding purpose, the fear or concern of ceasing to exist does have an obvious evolutionary purpose. When you are tempted to view yourself as immortal, it is probably a good idea to take that into account.

And yes, you can be an atheist while still believing that you have an immortal soul. You can also be a theist and not believe that you have an immortal soul.

I don't see how that would work. Logically, gods and immortal souls are interchangeable concepts. God is, after all, a mind without body, a spirit with no need for physical presence. Without matter [or energy of course!]

Bollocks either way. Same with re-incarnation. Even if such things DID exist, non-physicality would make interaction with the universe impossible, and therefore moot.

Of course people can believe or lack belief in all sorts of shit, but a atheist who gets there by accident without a clue how they got there is just another woo-ist in waiting.
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  #18  
Old 14th February 2017, 06:57 PM
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Default Re: Soul of an atheist

Sean Carroll explains it far better than I could.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bcqd3Q7X_1A
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  #19  
Old 14th February 2017, 07:49 PM
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Default Re: Soul of an atheist

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Darwinsbulldog said View Post
Quote:
142857 said View Post
On a slightly tangential note regarding purpose, the fear or concern of ceasing to exist does have an obvious evolutionary purpose. When you are tempted to view yourself as immortal, it is probably a good idea to take that into account.

And yes, you can be an atheist while still believing that you have an immortal soul. You can also be a theist and not believe that you have an immortal soul.

I don't see how that would work. Logically, gods and immortal souls are interchangeable concepts. God is, after all, a mind without body, a spirit with no need for physical presence. Without matter [or energy of course!]

Bollocks either way. Same with re-incarnation. Even if such things DID exist, non-physicality would make interaction with the universe impossible, and therefore moot.

Of course people can believe or lack belief in all sorts of shit, but a atheist who gets there by accident without a clue how they got there is just another woo-ist in waiting.
BBBuutt god made us in his image so he must have a body.
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  #20  
Old 14th February 2017, 07:58 PM
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Default Re: Soul of an atheist

his?
"Then God said, "Let us make mankind in our image, in our likeness, ...
Genesis 1:26
Are they clone gods?
Or maybe one only has a head, the other only arms etc
I bet the one that was just a penis was a real prick
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"Trust in the Lord with all your heart, don't rely on your own intelligence" Proverbs 3:5
Bible Jesus "But those enemies of mine who did not want me to be king over them, bring them here and kill them in front of me." Luke 19:27
"Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. Matthew 5:17
"Your male and female slaves are to come from the nations around you; from them you may buy slaves." Leviticus 24:44

Last edited by Iron Chariots; 14th February 2017 at 08:02 PM.
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