Go Back   AFA Forums > Atheism > Global Atheist Convention Forum

Global Atheist Convention Forum All discussions regarding the AFA's Global Atheist Conventions

Reply
 
Thread Tools
  #1  
Old 16th April 2012, 11:37 PM
IVPITER's Avatar
IVPITER IVPITER is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 530
Default Jim Jefferies cross the line?

I don't think this has been discussed here.
Jim Jefferies on Friday night was funny but one joke has been on my mind the last few days. As far as I can recall the joke went along with Jim saying, it would be easier if he was gay, he is a man's man, he gets along with men, but women hate him and he hates women but the reason he could never fuck a man is because he respects them too much.

The more I think about the more I think the joke is simply sexist.
__________________
'Those who invalidate reason ought seriously to consider whether they argue against reason with or without reason: if with reason, then they establish the principle that they are labouring to dethrone: but if they argue without reason (which, in order to be consistent with themselves they must do), they are out of reach of rational conviction, nor do they deserve rational argument'-Ethan Allen

Last edited by IVPITER; 16th April 2012 at 11:39 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 16th April 2012, 11:44 PM
Voltairine's Avatar
Voltairine Voltairine is offline
There will still be cheese
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: A pale blue dot
Posts: 3,045
Default Re: Jim Jefferies cross the line?

Can't agree there. He wasn't being literal, comedians exaggerate things, switcharoo things for the punchline. But then I'm a woman, perhaps a homosexual male would see it differently.
__________________
...
What, indeed, is an atheist? He is one who destroys delusions which are harmful to humanity in order to lead men back to nature, to reality, to reason. Baron d'Holbach

_____

If we go back to the beginnings of things, we shall always find that ignorance and fear created the gods; that imagination, rapture and deception embellished them; that weakness worships them; that custom spares them; and that tyranny favours them in order to profit from the blindness of men. Baron d'Holbach
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 16th April 2012, 11:44 PM
Keith_W's Avatar
Keith_W Keith_W is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 98
Default Re: Jim Jefferies cross the line?

I had no doubt it was sexist the moment I heard it. And so did a few women I spoke to.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 16th April 2012, 11:55 PM
heresy's Avatar
heresy heresy is offline
Sprite Zero: no sugar, tastes good - not funny, just true
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: temporary protection visa
Posts: 198
Default Re: Jim Jefferies cross the line?

proves a good point thought.

An atheist can be anything: a humanist, misogynist, nihilist, anarchist, Stalinist, communist, conspiracy theorist, and could even be a vegan!

George Carlin addressed the issue. He's an atheist I respect.

__________________
I am Jesus!

Last edited by heresy; 16th April 2012 at 11:57 PM. Reason: I'm a numpty, can't work out youtube quotes
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 17th April 2012, 12:09 AM
IVPITER's Avatar
IVPITER IVPITER is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 530
Default Re: Jim Jefferies cross the line?

I'm a fan of Always Sunny in Philadelphia. The characters are jerks, idiots and at times sexist. When a joke that is sexist on that show is told, it is clear to me that sexism is not endorsed nor are the characters at all portrayed as someone to look up to. It wasn't clear to me Jim was putting forward a view, however exaggerated, that he disagrees with.
__________________
'Those who invalidate reason ought seriously to consider whether they argue against reason with or without reason: if with reason, then they establish the principle that they are labouring to dethrone: but if they argue without reason (which, in order to be consistent with themselves they must do), they are out of reach of rational conviction, nor do they deserve rational argument'-Ethan Allen
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 17th April 2012, 12:29 AM
starr's Avatar
starr starr is offline
Rainbow Fairy
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Canberra
Posts: 129
Default Re: Jim Jefferies cross the line?

I was laughing so much at Jim Jefferies' act that I had to keep wiping away tears.

I don't think I laughed at that particular joke however. I remember feeling a bit shocked like 'did he really go there?'

It was a sexist joke and therefore I don't think it was an appropriate joke for the GAC.

He told the joke within a context of satirising a sexist and homophobic male. I imagine the purpose of this was to distance himself from the content as in 'it's not what I think...it's what sexist and homophobic men think'.

Such an approach gave the joke a thin veneer of acceptability. The veneer was very thin however.

The next day Marion Maddox made a comment during the panel discussion about the sexist content of the comedy. I was disappointed to hear a couple of audience members yell out 'it was just a joke' and 'you're not very pretty either'.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 17th April 2012, 01:25 AM
Martin_Madej's Avatar
Martin_Madej Martin_Madej is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Melbourne Australia
Posts: 122
Default Re: Jim Jefferies cross the line?

If your offended by that joke you obviously dont know Jim Jefferies or his work
He is a prick a sexist and womanising dick in his shows. he is satirising the social norms of past decades which is what makes it funny because if that shit happened now days the person involved would get his head bashed in.

im not saying that is doesn't happen there are a few laggards that still think that way.

To show my point which i have forgotten already here is a video of one of his shows


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1jaiMzLhliA
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 17th April 2012, 03:19 AM
mophosophical's Avatar
mophosophical mophosophical is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Townsville
Posts: 41
Default Re: Jim Jefferies cross the line?

I think his act was victim to a kind of Poe's law http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Poe%27s_Law

Another bloke and I were discussing this very subject at the dinner, and seemed to both come to the conclusion that it was ok. Soon after, the lovely lady that was sitting between us returned, and we asked her what she thought. As she paused a moment and started to inhale, in a manner one does when about to deliver a condemning rant, the other bloke and I exchanged a glance, silently communicating to each other "oh shit what have we got ourselves into" But then she only said something approximately like "Well he did seem a bit racist I know but I thought it was quite funny"

Confused by our chuckle, we explained we thought it was the sexism she would have been most offended by, but she said something like "Oh nah I didn't take that seriously"

I don't think Jim Jefferies truly believes that stuff. Like starr and Martin Madej say, it's just a parody of a stereotype. The veneer was so thin because he so convincingly performed it.
__________________
http://mophosophical.com/
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 17th April 2012, 06:34 AM
cyclist's Avatar
cyclist cyclist is offline
And if I can reach the pedals, I'll be sweet
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Sydney
Posts: 3,075
Default Re: Jim Jefferies cross the line?

I and a few others discussed this on Sunday night, the joke in isolation was in poor taste, but in hindsight I felt that it was leading up to his point about it being "an uncomfortable ride home".

I'll admit that I also laughed when he said "and that little Iraqi died" in relation to his helicopter ride into Baghdad. I felt pretty terrible laughing at that.

I think that Jim Jeffries was partly using that joke to show how misogynistic some men where, rather than expressing his own views. I may be putting words into his mouth or over analysing his joke, but that's my take.

There are plenty of sexist jokes out there, and I've heard that one way to determine if a joke is purely sexist is to reverse it.

Woman: I couldn't be a lesbian, I couldn't fuck someone I respect.

I can still see humour in that.

James
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 17th April 2012, 07:11 AM
starr's Avatar
starr starr is offline
Rainbow Fairy
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Canberra
Posts: 129
Default Re: Jim Jefferies cross the line?

We could examine the appropriateness of the joke for the GAC by asking what effect it would be likely to have on a group of men at a pub.

1. Some groups of men may have a discussion about whether or not it was OK to find the joke funny because they want to completely disassociate themselves from the sexist sentiment expressed.

2. Some other groups of men may use the joke to 'laugh at' the 'sexist man' portrayed in the joke. They may continue the 'satire' by expressing further sexist sentiments and 'play acting' that they think in the same sexist way.

3. Some other groups of men may fully embrace the sexist sentiments expressed in the joke and continue the 'joke' by expressing further sexist sentiments.

I don't think anyone would have a problem with the first scenario.

Perhaps most of us would have a problem with the third scenario.

The second scenario may be a grey area. Personally, I think the second scenario is pretty much as bad as the third. I think that type sexist satire can lead to men feeling like they have permission to 'act like' sexist pricks.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT +11. The time now is 12:37 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Feedback Buttons provided by Advanced Post Thanks / Like (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2018 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.