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Introduce Yourself Please introduce yourself and share what makes you faithless or faithful.

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  #41  
Old 14th November 2017, 01:12 PM
conditioned2 conditioned2 is offline
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Ooooppss, this was suppose to be in my last post:

No-one can pass on knowledge to another human being, all one can do is pass on information. The receiver of the information has to exert mental effort to convert that information into their own knowledge. The presentation of information that conflicts with the information you already have is the difficulty that everyone faces in order to learn.
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  #42  
Old 14th November 2017, 01:38 PM
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workmx workmx is offline
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conditioned2 said View Post
Ooooppss, this was suppose to be in my last post:

No-one can pass on knowledge to another human being, all one can do is pass on information. The receiver of the information has to exert mental effort to convert that information into their own knowledge. The presentation of information that conflicts with the information you already have is the difficulty that everyone faces in order to learn.
What is your definition of knowledge?

Justified true belief?
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  #43  
Old 14th November 2017, 01:42 PM
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The Irreverent Mr Black The Irreverent Mr Black is offline
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Some random peanuts found in the latest set of fewmets from our singularly enlightened visitor.

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conditioned2 said View Post
I must be a heretic to have a different point of view. What can I say, legions of monks and religious scholars has quibbled over their own misunderstandings.
Bit of a canard there! You may be an outlier, but it doesn't make you credible in any way.

They laughed at Einstein... sure, but they laughed at the unintended pratfall too.

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conditioned2 said View Post
If I rationally analysed “Animal Farm”, written by George Orwell, as if it was a matter-of-fact real story, and not an allegory, then people would rightly reject any reasoned arguments I may have put forward.
And seeing you were going against Orwell's stated intention, you'd rightly look like a complete nana.

You have chosen to single out ONE book from a collection (and your dereliction in discarding the other two synoptic gospels, which share much in common with Matthew, is still a glaring condemnation of the Single Seekrit Text Hypothesis), and have given no indication why it should be addressed alone, apart from the apophenic epiphany you claim.

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Philo of Alexandria (20 BC – 50 AD), said that the Bible was an allegory, yet many are quite happy to praise Thomas Paine’s rational analysis of the Bible, in his book “The Age of Reason”. Paine misunderstood the nature of the document he was critiquing, and so all of his comments missed their mark entirely. Heraclitus apparently said that what Homer wrote was allegorical. Its only information, and it is my last post.
Was Philo a time traveller? None of the gospels were written at that time, let alone the rest of the NT.

"He believed that literal interpretations of the Hebrew Bible would stifle humanity's perception of a God too complex and marvelous to be understood in literal human terms" - Wiki (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philo)

Payne was critiquing the OT plus the NT. Apples, oranges.

You're still only speaking from apophenia, and the borrowed plumes you have arranged around it tend to give your argument the appearance of a badly-taxidermied turkey.
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  #44  
Old 14th November 2017, 01:43 PM
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The Irreverent Mr Black The Irreverent Mr Black is offline
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Quote:
conditioned2 said View Post
Ooooppss, this was suppose to be in my last post:

No-one can pass on knowledge to another human being, all one can do is pass on information. The receiver of the information has to exert mental effort to convert that information into their own knowledge. The presentation of information that conflicts with the information you already have is the difficulty that everyone faces in order to learn.
There's confirmation bias, but there's also a bullshit filter.
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  #45  
Old 14th November 2017, 01:49 PM
nutmeg nutmeg is offline
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I studied Plato in the original Greek. His name was spelt Πλατων, derived from πλατυς
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  #46  
Old 14th November 2017, 04:01 PM
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Darwinsbulldog Darwinsbulldog is offline
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Quote:
conditioned2 said View Post
Ooooppss, this was suppose to be in my last post:

No-one can pass on knowledge to another human being, all one can do is pass on information. The receiver of the information has to exert mental effort to convert that information into their own knowledge. The presentation of information that conflicts with the information you already have is the difficulty that everyone faces in order to learn.
It depends what you mean by information. But data is data. For example, scientific facts, like the Earth is ~4.6 billion years old. Or that the atomic weight of carbon is ~12. Occasionally, scientific data can be wrong. For example, it was once thought that humans had 48 chromosomes, but we actually have 46. So mistakes can happen, but scientific method and procedures minimise the risk of that happening. Generally, scientific data gets more precise and accurate with time, because scientific information is cumulative.

Note this scientific data does not depend on belief. In fact, a lot of scientific discoveries are counter-intuitive. Like some aspects of quantum mechanics, or Einsteinian relativity. Nobody experiences the world of the miniature, or indeed travelling at the speed of light, so the science of it may seem odd to us.

Young earth creationists believe that the Earth is only a few thousand years old. This is of course wrong, not because such facts are make us comfortable or uncomfortable, but because of investigations and discoveries from many branches of science all converge on 4.6 billion years old.

Believing or not believing information is irrelevant. The belief that the Earth is only 10,000 years old or whatever, is simply a false belief, and false knowledge.

Indeed, science does the opposite of what is done in religion. In religion, faith, or strength of belief is regarded as a key virtue. But think about this. If a doctor says I have cancer, does my belief or disbelief have any bearing of the fact of cancer? I could get a second opinion etc. But if I had cancer, wishing it away simply would not work. One can take action though. Get medical treatment, put one's affairs in order so if the worst happens, one is prepared.

Or suppose I won a million dollars, or owed a million dollars. I either have or do not have the money. Either, my wishes on the subject are irrelevant. The facts remain the same.

So, yes, sometime people don't accept facts. But that does them and others harm. People refuse vaccinations or other medical treatment [such as blood transfusions or cancer treatment] because they believe in conflicts with their religious beliefs. They are only harming themselves and their loved ones.
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  #47  
Old 14th November 2017, 09:02 PM
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Strato Strato is offline
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You address your interlocutors as skeptics.

I am not skeptics concerning materiality and look forward to new discoveries of the nature of matter and dimensions of the 'hidden reality.'

I am skeptics like about the non-substantive, like spirituality or 'ancient wisdom.'

Unsubstantiated claims just like yours I am also skeptics last about.

That's healthy skepticism.
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