The islamic topic

[Plankton]

The "cops and robbers" view of history is agonisingly evident on the Sikh forums I frequent. 'The West' is apparently responsible for every little problem there, with out lack of morals, loose women, exploitation and evil heavy metal music. It drives me nuts!

But if it wasn't religion dividing people, it would be something else. Culture, skin colour, accent, ancestry, gender, food preference, type of morality... humans are as great at dividing up as we are grouping up.

[Logic please]

Originally Posted by Plankton

The "cops and robbers" view of history is agonisingly evident on the Sikh forums I frequent. 'The West' is apparently responsible for every little problem there, with out lack of morals, loose women, exploitation and evil heavy metal music. It drives me nuts!

But if it wasn't religion dividing people, it would be something else. Culture, skin colour, accent, ancestry, gender, food preference, type of morality... humans are as great at dividing up as we are grouping up.

Yes, there are many fault lines along which humans may choose to be divided.

But religion is still supremely effective as a divisive tool, however. And it has the added strength of unwarranted moral arrogance and sense of righteous destiny as motivators, in many cases.

[Plankton]

Good point LP.

Religion and politics, both great at dividing people and getting them fired up.

[Lilith_from_Fr]

Originally Posted by Plankton

Jesus is a big player, he gets lots of born again converts. But there's something in Islam which is attracting more followers. If not love, then is it the wealth of it's Arab men?

oh, I really doubt that

Originally Posted by Plankton

The stringent rules about who they can marry (requiring conversion unless you're already a person of the book in the case of women, or a Muslim already in the case of men)? The way in which they da'wah? Islam is gaining converts - why? My only idea is the lack of community people may be experiencing elsewhere, and the power and promises of their god character.

what about their god character? it always made me scared when I was a child.

Originally Posted by Plankton

Congrats on leaving Islam. Were you born into it or did you convert into it? What kind were you, Sunni, Shi'a? I hope you don't mind me asking such personal question.

yes, I was born in a muslim family, sunni one. but I went in a christian school when I was little, and as we had religious lessons on Jesus, and we prayed like christians, I started to ask question that scared my mother, she asked that I leave christian lessons, some other muslim families did that too with their children. too afraid to see their kids becoming christians.

Originally Posted by Plankton

It's funny that they should be so full of hate, since the Koran seems sympathetic at least to Christians (not so much Jews), from what I've read so far. Where do you think the anger comes from? The Crusades? Culturally, since 'the West' has a reputation for exploiting other countries for their resources like oil and coffee?

I think this anger is coming from the incapacity of arabic people to be adults. they act like teenagers. besides, the education given is based on fear of Allah, and on hate on jews. the boys are glorified, the girls are considered as evil creatures. I know it's a caricatural way of saying things, buit it, somehow reflects a certain reality.

Originally Posted by Plankton

It's so human-centric and micro-managed, and Arabic-culture infused, it's what keeps me from falling into that pit.

I know... that's what humans needs maybe, to feel special. but as said Neil Degrasse Tyson (thanks for the video), there's nothing that special about humans...

Originally Posted by Plankton

Coming back to the original topic, don't you think a lot of Muslims are already aware that Allah was a moon-god but they ignore it?

no, they really think he's the "real" God for everybody.

Originally Posted by Plankton

Do you think Muslims rely on Islam having 'roots' in Christianity and Judaism to reinforce their religion? I think, if you took Xianity and Judaism out of the picture, Muslims would still be Muslims.

yes, they think this ideology is coming from christians and jews. but reading the Koran is not suffisant to know islam, you have to read the hadiths, a bunch of crap that determines certain rules of living and stories of the prophet and all that.

I agree with you too on the last phrase you wrote. they still will be muslims. the pressure is very strong on them. and you know what is the punishement for leaving islam : death. the punishement for being a kufar : hell

maybe fear is what makes this ideology so strong.

[Plankton]

maybe fear is what makes this ideology so strong.

In the words of Andy Barnard, I think you "nailed it".

Bloody Plankton always going for the greener grass. It's only green cos it's been spray painted!

I think there has been enough research done on Judaism and Christianity to thoroughly prove that YWHW and Jehova are based on a tribal God... but it doesn't stop them. I think the same would be true for Muslims even if you had perfect archaeological proof that he's the Arabic moon god.