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Old 25th October 2016, 07:08 PM
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Default QPSSS response to Qld Ed Connect Review

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We thank the Queensland Department of Education for undertaking a review of the Connect program. Having read the report, we have a number of issues we would like to clarify and would greatly appreciate the department’s consideration and response to the following.

Full Response
by Queensland Parents for Secular State Schools...
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Old 26th October 2016, 12:57 AM
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Default Re: QPSSS response to Qld Ed Connect Review

Oh dear. Goodness. A bunker buster.

Abolition no less, eventually, inevitably.
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Old 26th October 2016, 02:20 PM
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Default Re: QPSSS response to Qld Ed Connect Review

That response took a considerable amount of time and expertise. QPSSS have all the connect materials past and present. Folks at the Kenmore atheist Community added some advice and thoughts. Some members at QPSSS have significant legal expertise which I think shows.

Pass the link around in your social networks and push whichever aspects of the response you think are most telling.

I liked this bit:

Quote:
n fact, this aligns with the initial advice given to us by the department in correspondence dated 23 December 2015, which stated, “In the context of the RI policy statement, proselytising applies to a cooperative arrangement because the authorised program covers more than one faith and participating students will have a religion from one of the faiths presented.” We responded by pointing out that many unaffiliated students are participating in RI, with or without parental permission. In reply to this the department simply reiterated that “soliciting a student for a decision to change that religious affiliation is not permitted in Queensland state schools.”
Despite this, RTI data that QPSSS obtained earlier this year shows that, for the schools subject to the request, and likely most schools in the state, the majority of students participating in RI are not affiliated with any religion and, therefore, allowing them to participate may constitute a breach of legislation.
QPSSS facebook page: https://www.facebook.com/QldParentsSecularStateSchools/
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"History, I believe, furnishes no example of a priest-ridden people maintaining a free civil government".
-Thomas Jefferson

Burden of proof is the obligation on somebody presenting a claim to provide evidence to support its truth (a warrant). Once evidence has been presented, it is up to any opposing "side" to show the evidence presented is not adequate. If claims were accepted without warrants, then every claim could simultaneously be claimed to be true.

History isn't written by the victors. It's written by the people with the time machines.

Last edited by DanDare; 26th October 2016 at 02:26 PM.
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Old 27th October 2016, 12:24 PM
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Default Re: QPSSS response to Qld Ed Connect Review

Part of the recent QPSSS investigations.

https://www.facebook.com/QldParentsS...40568689537756

Quote:
There was so much we wanted to share with you about Pastor Ron Onks' ministry in our state schools that we decided to present you with:
'The Best of Ron Onks'
RI Instructor to hundreds of Gold Coast state school students.
“Most of my 400 plus school students amongst my 38 classes in 5 schools have greatly enjoyed learning more about how Israel started and how Jesus Christ is our salvation. I continue reviewing the “10 Commandments” with the students to emphasize how sinful they are before our Holy God; thus they may see their need of the Saviour Jesus Christ. Most of my students now understand that they *cannot* get to Heaven by being a good person.”
(Newsletter dated September 15, 2015)
“This volunteer school ministry is increasingly under attack in parts of Australia...If Religious Education (sic) were to slip from our schools, most of these children would most certainly lose the one chance they have to explore their relationship with God. WE CAN’T AFFORD TO LOSE THAT OPPORTUNITY; THEIR ETERNAL DESTINY IS AT STAKE! (his emphasis).
(Newsletter dated September 15, 2015)


...


Yep, Ron even wants to save them from treating same-sex attracted people equally!
That’s Youthworks he is referring to, the youth ministry arm of the Sydney Anglicans and owner of CEP, the company that publishes Connect.
In his writings, Ron refers to a number of lessons from the Connect program, so it is clear that this program well supports his desire to proselytise students. And this program is still in use in our state schools.
At least Ron is up front about his aims, well with his supporters anyway. How many more instructors think and act like this, and how would we ever know…?
Pastor Ron, now appearing at Park Lake, Pacific Pines, Highland Reserve, Gaven, and the Coomera Rivers State Schools.
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"History, I believe, furnishes no example of a priest-ridden people maintaining a free civil government".
-Thomas Jefferson

Burden of proof is the obligation on somebody presenting a claim to provide evidence to support its truth (a warrant). Once evidence has been presented, it is up to any opposing "side" to show the evidence presented is not adequate. If claims were accepted without warrants, then every claim could simultaneously be claimed to be true.

History isn't written by the victors. It's written by the people with the time machines.
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  #5  
Old 27th October 2016, 09:27 PM
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Default Re: QPSSS response to Qld Ed Connect Review

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DanDare said View Post
That response took a considerable amount of time and expertise. QPSSS have all the connect materials past and present. Folks at the Kenmore atheist Community added some advice and thoughts. Some members at QPSSS have significant legal expertise which I think shows.
The response is indeed comprehensive and authoritative, Dan. Now the Queensland Department of Education can no longer postpone having to meet its demands, every one of them.
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Old 5th November 2016, 12:32 AM
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Default Re: QPSSS response to Qld Ed Connect Review

I found myself reflecting on this response and how well the whole thing is stated.

The comment I italicised I will commit to memory. That's striking. Connect are proselytising predators.

“I want you to consider what you think about Jesus’ miracle”
Immediately following the above, the instructor is told to indicate the visual aid of John 20: 30-31, which says:
“Jesus worked many other miracles for his disciples, and not all of them are written in this book. But these are written so that you will put your faith in Jesus as the Messiah and the Son of God. If you have faith in him, you will have true life”.
The children in this class are 7-9 years old and this kind of ‘set-up’ and ‘leading’ is not only seeking to influence and persuade (i.e. soliciting), it is done so coercively to such young, undiscriminating minds.
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Old 5th November 2016, 06:49 AM
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Default Re: QPSSS response to Qld Ed Connect Review

This is the link to the actual department review pdf : http://statements.qld.gov.au/Content...ust%202016.pdf
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"History, I believe, furnishes no example of a priest-ridden people maintaining a free civil government".
-Thomas Jefferson

Burden of proof is the obligation on somebody presenting a claim to provide evidence to support its truth (a warrant). Once evidence has been presented, it is up to any opposing "side" to show the evidence presented is not adequate. If claims were accepted without warrants, then every claim could simultaneously be claimed to be true.

History isn't written by the victors. It's written by the people with the time machines.
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Old 6th November 2016, 12:05 AM
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Default Re: QPSSS response to Qld Ed Connect Review

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Terms such as sin, punishment, death, and Jesus being nailed to the cross, found throughout the Connect program are a reflection of the Bible's content on which Christianity is based. While some non-Christians may take offence to the use of these terms, it would be difficult to provide Christian RI without reference to such terms and concepts.
The obvious recourse is to take action and abolish RI, don't you think? Is it a matter of one taking offense at these cardinal doctrines? That sounds haughty and it is beside the point.

It is ignoble doctrine, antiquated dogma. The notion that we are born infected with sin condition and need saving by vicarious atonement to be able to get right with this absolute and inscrutable, rapacious Abrahamic creator god is malign and conduces to societal and personal pathology. It is necessarily coercive, compelling a decision be made in consequence upon hearing this decree, the gospel of original sin and salvation from its consequences, unspeakable torment and anguish in hell for eternity. It is subversive of undiscriminating minds as the response noted.

It supplants understanding, able to be apprehended by children, of what we really are, that is, the product of the process of evolution generally and highly social and intelligent apes in particular, one species. It is purposely adverse to our modern, post Enlightenment understanding based in science, reason, democratic enquiry discovering what we are and what conduces to well-being.

The Queensland Department of Education is equivocating.
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Last edited by Strato; 6th November 2016 at 12:11 AM.
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  #9  
Old 6th November 2016, 11:33 AM
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Default Re: QPSSS response to Qld Ed Connect Review

I think the promotion of an myth a truth is offensive, because it is dishonest. Claims are being made solely on the strength of belief, and not the quality or quantity of evidential support, never mind the dearth of logic in these claims. That sort of disinformation should offend everyone.
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Old 7th November 2016, 03:31 PM
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Default Re: QPSSS response to Qld Ed Connect Review

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Strato said View Post
The Queensland Department of Education is equivocating.
No they are strongly corrupted by partisans.
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"History, I believe, furnishes no example of a priest-ridden people maintaining a free civil government".
-Thomas Jefferson

Burden of proof is the obligation on somebody presenting a claim to provide evidence to support its truth (a warrant). Once evidence has been presented, it is up to any opposing "side" to show the evidence presented is not adequate. If claims were accepted without warrants, then every claim could simultaneously be claimed to be true.

History isn't written by the victors. It's written by the people with the time machines.
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