Atheism in schools

[FSM]

That's an issue I will have to tackle in another few years time.
Our closest school is a catholic one, and it's the one SWMBO went to, so naturally has a fond affinity for it. SWMBO also thinks that catholic schools are "nicer" and practice more "love" toward the children and teach them better "values" etc as per the "christian values"

But unfortunately DanDare may be right, kids may get more RE in a public school these days than they would in a conservative catholic school.

Dave.

[Justtristo]

Originally Posted by steveeeee73

My name is Stephen Lewis and I am in my late 30's and have always been an atheist however Richard Dawkins' book "The God Delusion" turned me into an atheistr activist.
In Australia we have an unfortunate situation in education. Unforunately religous based private schools are seen by the general public as superior and secular public schools are not as good as religous prvate schools. However I believe religion is so bad that I would rather have my childtren receive a education without religous indoctrination in a public school.

The big majority of non-government schools in Australia are either Catholic, Orthodox Christian or Anglican and (what I have heard from various people I have spoken to) often do a better job when it comes to teaching about different religions than the state schools. Such schools would be object much to objective comparative religious education mandates from the government.

The Evangelical Christian schools (which make up the rest of the non-government schools) on the other hand are pretty bad in that particular area. Not to mention these schools having the habit of teach creationism in the Science classroom. Given they were responsible (via Family First) in overturning a ban on the teaching of creationism in non-government and home schools in South Australia. They would give stiff opposition to having objective comparative religious education required in their schools.

[Alex]

well guess what I removed my kids in kindy at a catholic school for a secular education in a government school and EXTREMELY pissed off to find out they recite the lords prayer before all assemblies!!!

[Alex]

Hiya I took my kiddies out in kindy at a catholic school after the ridiculous level of indoctrination and teachings of creationism, only to move them to a government school that wasn't secular, they say the lords prayer at school assemblies, I kid you not, I am in the process of trying to have it removed and the town wants to burn me at the stake!

[Nursey]

My wife and I are in the process of enrolling our (free thinking, secular)Yr 6 daughter into the local Anglican school for the start of her secondary education, as we are limited for choice in regards to a good education, and for the best part, they have a sound curriculum.

I should state that I am a recently "outed" atheist (dragged up a catholic), and my wife still holds on to her strict catholic upbringing (but I'm working on her ), who wants a good education for our children (who doesn't?).

I still have my reservations regarding the compulsory religious curriculum, however, I feel my daughter is now of the age where she can intellectually and subjectively question any proselytizing that the school may take part in.

I for one, will encourage my daughter to do this with respect and with the knowledge that the people she is meant to listen to, are themselves possibly indoctrinated to the point of no return, and believe that their students should believe in what rubbish they're teaching.

All I can do is give my daughter the best opportunities in life possible, and protect her from any proselytizing by giving her the best gift of all, love and a thirst for knowledge (Oh...and a copy of Richard Dawkins "The Magic of Reality" ).

[FSM]

Originally Posted by Nursey

My wife and I are in the process of enrolling our (free thinking, secular)Yr 6 daughter into the local Anglican school for the start of her secondary education, as we are limited for choice in regards to a good education, and for the best part, they have a sound curriculum.

I should state that I am a recently "outed" atheist (dragged up a catholic), and my wife still holds on to her strict catholic upbringing (but I'm working on her ), who wants a good education for our children (who doesn't?).

I still have my reservations regarding the compulsory religious curriculum, however, I feel my daughter is now of the age where she can intellectually and subjectively question any proselytizing that the school may take part in.

I'm unfortunately going to have to possibly face the same choice in the coming decade.
And I'm of the opinion at this stage, that a religious primary school would be probably ok, as they will just laugh it off like Santa etc and readily forget about it all as they grow up.
But I'd be much more concerned about sending my child to a religious high school. A point in their development when I think they would be the most vulnerable and really should be learning to speak their mind and think for themselves. And I think sending them to a religious high school where they would have to likely keep their mouth shut as all the babble takes place, is not setting a good example for them, not a good environment for them.
But I haven't given it much thought, that just seems like my initial impression at this stage.

Dave.

[FSM]

Originally Posted by Justtristo

The Evangelical Christian schools (which make up the rest of the non-government schools) on the other hand are pretty bad in that particular area. Not to mention these schools having the habit of teach creationism in the Science classroom. Given they were responsible (via Family First) in overturning a ban on the teaching of creationism in non-government and home schools in South Australia. They would give stiff opposition to having objective comparative religious education required in their schools.

WTF?! Creationism is being taught in Australian schools?
When did this slip through?
What's being done about it?

Dave.

[Nursey]

Originally Posted by FSM

I'm unfortunately going to have to possibly face the same choice in the coming decade.
And I'm of the opinion at this stage, that a religious primary school would be probably ok, as they will just laugh it off like Santa etc and readily forget about it all as they grow up.
But I'd be much more concerned about sending my child to a religious high school. A point in their development when I think they would be the most vulnerable and really should be learning to speak their mind and think for themselves. And I think sending them to a religious high school where they would have to likely keep their mouth shut as all the babble takes place, is not setting a good example for them, not a good environment for them.
But I haven't given it much thought, that just seems like my initial impression at this stage.

Dave.

FSM I agree with what you are saying, but wouldn't it be great if your child started high school already armed with the gift of free thinking, and could intelligently question whatever was being taught in regards to religion?

If it was a case of "shut up or put up" in the classroom, then I would certainly have to step in, but if it was more of a "discussion" rather than a sermon, then I would certainly encourage my child to stand on her soap box and demand to be heard (as long as she did it in an intelligent and informed manor of course).

[FSM]

Originally Posted by Nursey

FSM I agree with what you are saying, but wouldn't it be great if your child started high school already armed with the gift of free thinking, and could intelligently question whatever was being taught in regards to religion?

He will be, courtesy of me.

If it was a case of "shut up or put up" in the classroom, then I would certainly have to step in, but if it was more of a "discussion" rather than a sermon, then I would certainly encourage my child to stand on her soap box and demand to be heard (as long as she did it in an intelligent and informed manor of course).

Of course.
I've got no problem with religion in schools, provided it's discussion about religion as you say.
The issue with a religious secondary school though I image would be that it would be very hard for a secular non-religious student to sit out any religious classes or chapel stuff etc. They'd likely have to sit there with their arms folded and their mouth shut as their fellow students mumble along like sheep.
And this is about the age that they feel massive peer pressure and begin to form strong opinions about things. So that's why imaging that a religious secondary education is potentially more harmful than a primary one.
In primary school, it's more like they are just singing silly songs

Perhaps I'm wrong on that, and the evidence does not confirm that, but it seems fairly likely to me at first thought.

Dave.

[Justtristo]

Originally Posted by FSM

WTF?! Creationism is being taught in Australian schools?
When did this slip through?
What's being done about it?

Dave.

Indeed creationism is taught in the "Christian" (Evangelical) schools.

The South Australian government tried to forbid non-government and home schools from teaching creationism. However the measure was defeated in the state's legislative council, after the Family First party (who are in the legislative council in South Australia) complained about it.