The Mysterious Man

[Fearless]

Ok so I happened to ask my 'Spiritual Advisor' (SA) (who I will stop referring to directly from now on otherwise I will seem obsessive) how she came to believe there was a higher being.

She has always mentioned of one incident which happened when she was a child on the beach one day. She said that she was with her best friend who was sitting on the... I was going to say sand but many English beaches are pebbles... anyway while she was swimming and playing in the water a big wave knocked her over and she could not find her footing and after a short time realised she was drowning.

All of a sudden she was picked up by a strange man who carried her to the shoreline and placed her down. After a few seconds he was gone. Both my SA and her best friend saw the man but did not see him leave. There was no one else on the beach.

My SA says her best friend is a non believer but has never been able to explain what happened that day which in some ways is apparently why they have remained good friends to today, and is why my SA was always trying to find an answer or explanation to the mysterious man.

I think he turned around, jumped back in the water again and resumed swimming. But yeah this is why my SA has no doubt there is more to this life.

[Sir Patrick Crocodile]

Ok so I happened to ask my 'Spiritual Advisor' (SA) (who I will stop referring to directly from now on otherwise I will seem obsessive) how she came to believe there was a higher being.
I have OCD so I'm a lot more obsessive than that - and if somethings "not right" then it makes me very upset. So I guess it's OK then.
She has always mentioned of one incident which happened when she was a child on the beach one day. She said that she was with her best friend who was sitting on the... I was going to say sand but many English beaches are pebbles... anyway while she was swimming and playing in the water a big wave knocked her over and she could not find her footing and after a short time realised she was drowning.

All of a sudden she was picked up by a strange man who carried her to the shoreline and placed her down. After a few seconds he was gone. Both my SA and her best friend saw the man but did not see him leave. There was no one else on the beach.

My SA says her best friend is a non believer but has never been able to explain what happened that day which in some ways is apparently why they have remained good friends to today, and is why my SA was always trying to find an answer or explanation to the mysterious man.

I think he turned around, jumped back in the water again and resumed swimming. But yeah this is why my SA has no doubt there is more to this life.
I reckon she saw the man and then turned around to her friend and then the man was gone. It happened to me in university. Once I was entering the Central Lecture Block (CLB as they call it) and the people I was talking to (for a group assignment) saw me go in there. I then went out and into the toilet next to CLB - and a few minutes later I came out and the people told me that they didn't see me go in the toilet.
I think it is called "attentive blindness" and it happens to many people. Particularly the religious people - for some reason.

[Fearless]

I have OCD so I'm a lot more obsessive than that - and if somethings "not right" then it makes me very upset. So I guess it's OK then.

Forgive me as I am not 100% sure what you mean. I understand OCD, but I didn't mean my obsessive concern to relate in an OCD context if that's what you meant.

All I really meant was I tend to talk a lot about my mother (my so called spiritual advisor ;) ) as she is the only religious person I really converse with about religion etc... my obsession was more about how often I talk about her here on the forums.

I converse with her mainly for two main reasons, one, so I can gauge just how entrenched religion is with her and two so I can start to talk to her about my views and 'disbeliefs'.

As for the story... I learned about scotomas years ago where the mind tends to block out the view for whatever reason. My mother is so sure this wasn't just her imagination as it was shared by another.

I can't really take her story away from her but if I ever get a chance to talk with her friend (in the UK) it might be a slightly different story.

I guess the story is an example of how one person can have an experience and can only attribute it to something with a higher meaning.

She also had another story more recently when she was talking to her brother, my uncle (again in the UK) where he was calling her from a payphone at 2am. She was so worried about his welfare she told him that she was going to pray that he would be 'looked after' on his return home. Moments after she said it, he said he had to hang up the phone as two young guys were approaching him.
My uncle apparently phoned my mother the next day. He said they asked him what he was doing out at that time of the night and proceeded to escort him home to make sure he arrived safely. My uncle apparently told her this later. AFAIK my uncle is not religious.

It's these sorts of things that keep my mother in no doubt of her beliefs. Obviously out of respect I don't make fun or doubt her openly. If that is what she wants to believe then well ok. It would be good now if her praying got my step father out of hospital from his partial vegetative state... if he came out tomorrow then I would be starting to wonder WTF! but he is no doubt going to be in there for months and may never come out. Does praying on one person start to expire after a while I wonder.

[Sir Patrick Crocodile]

I guess it is to do with her being lazy not considering other factors. Just like the time people used to think rain and lightning were acts of God

[TÐöer]

That's alright... We love to hear your stories.

Well, I've encounted plenty of miracles myself. Once upon a time, my father found a snake at a tree, which the boys were playing under.Luckily no one was hurt. No one even knew it was there.

Here's another. On a camping trip, on a mountain, it had been raining all day. We were all cold, and soon realised that our camp, and clothes were all wet. and we were freezing. By the time we decided to cut short our advanture, mist had blanketed the jungle, and it was getting dark. On our route back, we were stunned, to see that the streams we had passed while climbing up, had turned into rivers.

We braved through all of it, but at the final point. The waterfall, had completely covered, the only stairs down the mountain. Water was gushing down, if we had tried and slipped, it could mean only certain death. We were shivering and indecisive. Suddenly, an old man walk pass us, smilling, and without a worry, started descending like it wasn't a big deal.

That gave us the courage, to go down, and to this day, I am still not sure how we managed it. When we reach the bottom, the old man had disappeared. Probably went further down the path.

The moral of the story is, I'm not even a Christian, I thought God, only helps on condition of Faith. What if it was a different god? or what if it was just sheer luck?
Your mom, cannot attribute that miracle to God. Well, who knows, it could even have been a mermaid ;)

[Cosmic Teapot]

I guess the story is an example of how one person can have an experience and can only attribute it to something with a higher meaning.


Have you schooled her in the argument from incredulity? God of the Gaps?
Warm and fuzzy personal experiences are all good and fine until the person in question starts getting arrogant about their importance, a la "I have a divine purpose because god/Jesus saved me".

[Sir Patrick Crocodile]

That's where the good ol' Flying Spaghetti Monster comes in.

[Sir Patrick Crocodile]

Personally I don't like the idea of having religion in the census form at all. It is stupid. They might as well have things like "Do you believe that Harry Potter is a good marketing initiative?" in there while they're at it targeting beliefs.

We should start putting one religion at a time - first year Jedi and second year Matrixism etc

Or even better - screw up the statistics by placing Hindu or something that is there...

[eclectic]

I must admit I put jedi one year... but I was a teenager, and it was mostly to make my Ma write it down which was quite funny to me at the time. (she put herself and my brother as "no religion") Last census I was still new-agey and probably put 'pagan' or some such nonesense... next time (next year?) I can finally put atheist or 'none'. yay!

[wolty]

Yep atheist for me as well.
Anyone got any up to date figures on the decline of religiosity in Australia? I would be interested in reading them.

[Mister Pervert]

I'll beat Vonnie to the response here: keep your FSM off your Census Form!

Giving the Boo Roe of Stats a funny answer like "Jedi" or "Pastafarian" makes you a "Church (Other)" for the figures, and makes the Baby Jeebus smile.

Hopefully there will be an "Atheist" or "None" box to tick, this time round.

Just reinforcing Mr B's comments here.

Last Census, I wrote something stupid like "Lapsed Satanist" and it wasn't recorded - not specifically.

Be bold: "Atheist", as a Census thing, if enough people claim to be so, it WILL form a category for the numbnuts who compile stats for the Census collectors.

[Sir Patrick Crocodile]

Church of Google (http://www.thechurchofgoogle.org/)

[Seamus]

The last time I filled in a form stating my religion was in the army.

I was warned before I was inducted by a very smart bloke: The army doesn't like individuals,so be a dumb grunt;put SOMETHING in the 'religion' box. I put RC,as I ran into some guys from school. Then I spent two years being a dumb grunt.

I leave the census question about religion blank.I tell the government as little as possible. It's not that I distrust the pricks,it's just that I have no reason to trust them either.

Um, OK,I lied,I don't trust the government,at all. I think one of the most chilling sentences in the English language is "I'm from the government and I'm here to help you" (I was a career Public Servant) :p

[Fearless]

"I'm from the government and I'm here to help you"

Sounds like a line from a super hero... If I had more time it could be an opportunity for a photochop :P

[Mister Pervert]

Um, OK,I lied,I don't trust the government,at all. I think one of the most chilling sentences in the English language is "I'm from the government and I'm here to help you" (I was a career Public Servant) :p

"When the government says it is doing something for your own good you can be sure your welfare is the last thing they're thinking of." - Mark Twain.

Case in point: more taxes on cigarettes.

At the rate they're going, it will soon be cheaper (and more legal) to smoke dope.