AFA Forums

Religious Fundamentalism

Greetings all.
Thi thread came about because of the recent sad death of another Australian in Afganistan and the bombing in Jakarta.
After watching the interviews of Kevin Rudd and others I was struck by the fact that no one seems to be able to say Religious extremism. It is always terrorists that do it. I am sure that saying religious extremism would be a great conscious raiser for the australian people.

Secondly the interview with the guy from the lowy institute on the 7.30 report was very interesting because he mentioned that more deaths would make the people of aus rethink their involvement in afganistan and maybe it is getting to the time where we need to come home and look after ourselves. He also made the point that terrorism is maybe something we have to learn to live with.

My point about this is I would really like to know what people think about the world in maybe 100 years. It seems to me that there is no end in sight with islamic jihadists ( and chrissy fundys fighting them as well ). Do we just accept that we have to live with extremism? Will things be different in 100 years. Is it possible to raise Australian consciousness about present religious wars and have the people of aus infect the world with peace?

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The Good Samaritan

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400+ Atheism vs Thesim Debates

http://commonsenseatheism.com/?p=50

Found this site mentioned in a thread over at Atheist Nexus. Looks interesting.


And there is a list of books about Atheism here:
http://www.michaelnugent.com/2009/07...atheist-books/

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Rock Music: The Devils Advocate

I stumbled along a website relating to Christian beliefs on music and was
Horrified, Amazed, Confused and humored to find that this kind of view exists.

I particularity enjoyed reading that people actually believe that the oh so famous Led Zeppelin song "Stairway To Heaven" actually contains satanic messages when playedbackwards:

Quote: The song "Stairway to Heaven" by the group Led Zeppelin is the
most popular song in rock history. One line of the song, says, "you
know sometimes words have TWO MEANINGS." They should know
— the song is drenched in satanic backmasking! One part when
played forward, says: "Yes, their are two paths you can go by,
but in the long run there's still time to change the road you're on."
But when played backwards, you clearly hear: "IT'S MY SWEET SATAN
. . . Oh I will sing because I live with Satan." This is
the number one song in rock history! Just a coincidence —
not hardly! Jimmy Page of Led Zeppelin is a devout follower of satanist,
Aliester Crowley. One of Crowley's satanic teachings, learn to cast unsuspecting
spells on people by saying them backwards! Zeppelin's song "Houses
of the Holy", they sing, "Let the music be YOUR MASTER/

Will you heed the master's call/ Oh, Satan . . ."

Anyway, an interesting read for anybody that has a passion for music/(anti)religion.

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moon landing 40 years today

This monumental achievement still blows my mind today. All hail the moon men!! Science at its finest. Bet you can't guess what my hobbie is , it involves 8 inches and a lot of oohhhs and ahhhhs.

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News from a neighbouring country.

Sorry, but this topic has nothing to do with religion.

Just short of his wedding on the weekend, a political aide was found dead on the 5th floor roof of the Malaysian Anti Corruption Commission Building. He was held for a day as witness against his boss, but was found dead a few hours after his interrogation. He apparently fell to his death.

http://mt.m2day.org/2008/content/view/24621/84/

Who can we call for help?

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Islam is not a race!

This is a rant. I was listening to good old TripleJ the other day who are usually better at this, and there is a show on in the evenings called Hack... anyway this one story was about muslims perceiving Australia being a dangerous place for muslims because apparently we're racist. Because a muslim woman was killed, in GERMANY, after she took a man to court for calling her a muslim wh*re and accused him of RACISM!!

ISLAM IS NOT A RACE goddammit. Middle eastern/Arab, Asian, Aboriginal, African, Caucasion...these are races! Islam, christianity, catholocism, buddism, scientology... these are religions!

I just want people to stop confusing this because you're making it worse!!!

Oh the other thing that irritated me was they did a poll of people and whether they felt threatened in Australia by Islam. I certainly do and not because of the liklihood that someone will fly a plane into my house, it's more insidious than that. It's sneakily shifting the perception that ISLAM IS A RACE instead of a RELIGION to make it easier for them to get laws passed against people speaking out against their religion on the grounds of racism!

:mad: Anyway that's all. Sorry for the rant but this really made me angry.

[[Disclaimer - In no way do I condone the killing of ANYONE and I think the actions of the man who killed the muslim woman in Germany were atrocious - a link to the story ]]

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The Implicit Association Test - Religion

Would you like to take the IAT (Implicit Association Test) and find out just which religions get furthest up your nose?

If so, go to: https://implicit.harvard.edu/implici...turedtask.html

That url should take you to the test for religious bias.

Just in case the featured test has changed when you get there, you might like to try: https://implicit.harvard.edu/implicit/Study?tid=-1

My own bias showed that I find the Hindus less of a problem that the Jews and Christians who scored equally and the Muslims who are currently at the bottom of my approval scale.

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It's been 2 years since my last "drink" (of holy communion)

Hello,

Have been reluctant to join but found the site fascinating, thought provoking with a humorous side. I guess I was reluctant having only just being "cleansed of the meme virus" just under 2 years ago, and not wanting to be pigeon-holed again or in yet another group of another kind of idea. I can, however, live with the site's description of atheism. I definitely no longer believe in a sky fairy....and yes, it was rather like finding out Santa & the tooth fairy were just made up as a child at first but I'm out and loving a new sense of self and have now been set free. I had that guilt thing down to a fine art! Hoping AA (Atheists Anonymous) can lead me further down this road which, from what I can see and have already experienced here, will no doubt come to fruition.

I was a 3rd generation fundamentalist who was initially raised in the largest AOG church in Adelaide - I think Hillsongs little cousin or little sister or something incestual like that. I won't go into the nitty gritty here but happy to post more of a coming out story under the appropriate forum topic.

By the way, although I've always held some level of logical thought process it is something I'm working on....I am a work in progress.....a learner if you will but I'm a quick learner so I hope it won't be too tedious for you.

See you in the forums. :)

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Family values..... what is it exactly

This has always made me wonder when ever I hear the religous right harping on about "family values" or "traditional family values".

And when ever i have asked a proponent of "family values" they havn't really been able to calrify exactly what they are on about... most of the time it seems to be a really hardline anti-gay message. But for some reason evolution tends to be thrown in there as well every now and then.

So can somebody explain to me exactly what they mean by this? also as a side note, is it just me or do they think that there is some massive conspiracy to make everyone homosexual when they talk about the "gay agenda?"

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Up Up And Away

What was the most important thing to happen on July 20th?

Not the moon landing (you silly billy).

July 20th is the day when Mohammed ascended into heaven and received the command that prayers should be said five times each day.

:rolleyes:

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Will be reading more H L Mencken in future!

"The way to deal with superstition is not to be polite to it, but to tackle it with all arms, and so rout it, cripple it, and make it forever infamous and ridiculous. Is it, perchance, cherished by persons who should know better? Then their folly should be brought out into the light of day, and exhibited there in all its hideousness until they flee from it, hiding their heads in shame.

True enough, even a superstitious man has certain inalienable rights. He has a right to harbor and indulge his imbecilities as long as he pleases, provided only he does not try to inflict them upon other men by force. He has a right to argue for them as eloquently as he can, in season and out of season. He has a right to teach them to his children. But certainly he has no right to be protected against the free criticism of those who do not hold them. He has no right to demand that they be treated as sacred. He has no right to preach them without challenge. Did Darrow, in the course of his dreadful bombardment of Bryan, drop a few shells, incidentally, into measurably cleaner camps? Then let the garrisons of those camps look to their defenses. They are free to shoot back. But they can't disarm their enemy."
-- H L Mencken, "Aftermath" (coverage of the Scopes Trial) The Baltimore Evening Sun, (September 14, 1925)

Spotted the quote thanks to one Bucky Katt on Fark.com.

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Noosa, Qld - the Hillsong disease infests state school

Hat-tip GroupSects

Quote: “…..It gives the church an opportunity to have a foot in the door…to show them love in this basic simple way. Just to show them that they are special and to give them those principles that my mum gave me that I know they might not get if they’re not in a Christian family.

I want to see these young girls come to a knowledge of salvation…to get to know Jesus Christ as their Lord and Saviour….” – ‘Sunshine’ (from Youtube video) Quote: “Shine is a nine-week personal development program designed by Hillsong CityCare to help young women tackle issues of self-esteem, value and self-worth.

SHINE is a community-based, not religious based program, which Hillsong City Care and Hillsong Youth Services facilitate in 10 schools in Sydney. The SHINE program is delivered in a non-confrontational, non-religious way to young women from a range of backgrounds.

Professionally qualified staff, with degrees in youth work, community work and welfare, facilitate Shine in schools and also provide group and one-on-one facilitator training to volunteers as well as ongoing support…..”
- From Hill$ong Shine Program Statement, July 26, 2008. Little Stepford Bobbie Houstons!

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Jesus loves the little zygotes

LOL




Jesus loves the little zygotes
all the zygotes of the world.
Jesus loves them until they're born
then abandons them forlorn.
Jesus loves the little zygotes 'til they're born.

Jesus loves the little children
all the children of the world.
Jesus gives them heart defects
measles, mumps, and ringwormed necks.
Jesus loves the little children of the world.

Jesus lets their parents beat them,
bruise their bodies black and blue.
Jesus gives them birth defects,
scurvy, ticks, and palette clefts.
Jesus loves the little children of the world.

Jesus gives the children cancer.
Earaches, lice, and scabies too.
Bowel obstructions, altered lips,
blighted brains and twisted hips.
Extra chromosomes to help them when they pray.

Hallelujah.

Jesus gives the children acne.
AIDS and leprosy galore.
Germs and worms of every kind.
Things to make the children blind.
But he cannot give them smallpox anymore.

Scientists and unbelievers
wiped the pox right off the earth.
Jesus still gives gifts to kids,
broken nose and burnt eyelids.
But he cannot give them smallpox anymore.

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Charity

During a discussion at work last week, someone mentioned a report that showed the bulk of charity work carried out in Australia could be attributed to churches. Has anyone seen this report?
Charitable works are the main justification for religious organisations getting tax breaks, so if this report exists and the claimed skew in favour of the faith full is true they might have a right to that status and to claim that religion makes people nicer.
I'm dubious, however, as I am sure the religious people I know who are involved in charity would continue to volunteer their time and energy to improve their community if they didn't have their faith. There might be some who look at the stick (hell) or the carrot (heaven) and perform good deeds to avoid one and win the other but that's not charity in my book. Work performed through fear is slavery and work performed for reward is employment.
I am also unsure how charitable some charities are. A lot of church community services require that those receiving help must be willing to at least perform lip service to the faith of the service provider. No communal prayer, no soup for you! Again, the reward (potential converts, alleged brownie points with deity) undermines the charitable deed.
Please get in touch if you can guide me to the report my colleague alluded to but couldn't produce.

It did get me thinking about my voluntary contributions to my community, though. I do a few things but a return to the workforce after many years of student life hasn't seen me return to former levels of charitable effort. I could excuse myself that new parenthood offers me the opportunity to shape a young life into a pillar of the next generation and that that is sufficient contribution to society but I think I'll start visiting the local old folks home to lend an ear to some lonely people and see where things go from there.



Can you tell I've got a thesis to write?
WLB

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No nonsense health insurance

I am looking to get some health insurance.
Can anyone recommend a provider that won't subsidise other peoples' homeopathy with my hard earned dollars, please?
Cheerio
WLB

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Christian Assemblies International (CAI)

Well, saw me leg off! Imagine someone abusing his position of religious authority for personal sexual gratification. Incredible!

I note that he's "required not to approach former members of Christian Assemblies International". I guess current members are still fair game.

From my local rag:


Cult leader on sex crime charges

THE leader of a secretive religious group based on the Upper Orara has appeared in court on 14 charges of aggravated indecent assault, sexual assault and sexual intercourse without consent.
Senior Christian Assemblies International (CAI) pastor Anthony Scott Williams appeared in Coffs Harbour Local Court on Tuesday with police alleging the offences were aggravated by his use of his position as the Overseer (highest authority) of the organisation of which the victims were members.
The charges included indecent assault of a victim under the authority of the offender; assault with an act of indecency; aggravated sexual assault of a victim under the authority of the offender and sexual intercourse without the consent of the victim.
Mr Williams, 65, of Christian Assemblies International Pacific Headquarters at Wayper Creek Road, Upper Orara, was on bail after being arrested on June 5 following allegations that he had had sexual intercourse without consent with a member of his church.
The charges involved two different male victims, both allegedly members of CAI at the time, and related to alleged offences on a variety of occasions between 2002 and 2005 in Coffs Harbour, Upper Orara and Byron Bay.
The charges allege that Mr Williams had sexual intercourse with one of the victims on a number of occasions, knowing the victim was not consenting.
It was alleged that on other occasions Mr Williams touched the same victim's penis and masturbated him, again without his consent.
It was also alleged Mr Williams touched another victim's shoulders, chest and groin area without his consent.
Mr Williams was required to surrender his passports as part of his continuing bail conditions, to report weekly to Coffs Harbour Police, not to leave NSW and to continue living at his present residence at the CAI Pacific Headquarters at Wayper Creek Road in Upper Orara.
He was also required not to approach former members of Christian Assemblies International.
The case was adjourned to Coffs Harbour Local Court for mention on November 10.

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Letter in The Sunday Age

El Presidente has a letter in the paper. :)

http://www.theage.com.au/opinion/let...1.html?page=-1

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Church fights for right to discriminate

Full article http://www.theage.com.au/national/ch...x.html?page=-1

Quote: A CONTROVERSIAL review of Victoria's Equal Opportunity Act is threatening to become a political headache for the Brumby Government, with many churches, religious leaders, parents and private schools vowing to defend discrimination based on faith.
The parliamentary review, covering all areas of discrimination — including whether private men's clubs can continue to exclude women — has sparked widespread alarm among religious Victorians, from the Catholic Archbishop of Melbourne to Islamic, Christian and Jewish schools, and faith-based hospitals and aged-care centres.
At stake, these groups say, is their religious freedom to discriminate within churches, schools and church-run welfare services.
Under the 53 exceptions and exemptions to the Equal Opportunity Act, a religious organisation can insist on staff sharing its belief. A Christian private school, for example, can legally discriminate by refusing a Muslim a job as a teacher, receptionist or cleaner. (continued)

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is Sarsi a Root Beer?

Looking up Fanta, got me to root beers, got me to sarsi... lol...

I didn't realise that sarsi was classified as a root beer before. :confused:

Where I come from A&W root beer is the only root beer.

What other brands aussies love to drink?

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